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The Great Purge and Boycott: BKOS UPDATE

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For those new to the Moose you might not know but, in the three years it’s been on four legs, we’ve developed a set of self-moderating guidelines that mean we generally forebear talking at length about other progressive blogs, and I don’t think there has been one diary on them.

There’s are several good reasons for this: it’s generally bad to talk behind other people’s backs, and also dangerous, as slagging off someone here can come back and bite you at other places. Generally meta discussions are also tediously dull to the uninitiated, the blog equivalent of psephology. At worst, meta is like gerrymandering, changing the rules or the boundaries in order to game a result. At best, it is like talking about electoral mechanisms and voting machines. Dull, dull, dull and usually irrelevant.

I say ‘usually’ because of course gerrymandering districts is a huge slow problem in US politics, leading to the polarisation we see now, and electoral voting mechanisms were rather important in Florida in 2000.

In terms of the left blogosphere, I think the story below is important, and can’t really be ignored. But I’m open to being convinced otherwise, and will delete this diary if it causes too much offence. I’ve stripped out the links in my diary too, for obvious reasons if you read the piece, though I have left one in which precipitated this boycott. If you agree with the boycott, please try not to log in when you read the link.

I don’t know how this will resolve itself. The worst thing that can happen (for you guys) is that I’ll devote all my blogging energies to the Moose from now on. Whatever happens, last night, as dozens of diaries were published with the ‘boycott’ tag and hundreds of previously silent commenters came forward to voice support, was a tremendous moment for me of the power of solidarity. You don’t feel scared that you’ll be punished for speaking out with so many others there to support you. You also don’t care if you will be banished, because all the other great people seem to have down tools too.

So have at it. Please feel free to ignore this diary and its contents. I won’t make a comment if no-one else does. I definitely won’t FP this either.

UPDATE TODAY: Bkos diary is up for 15 minutes before deletion. It consists of this

And then in the comments this statement

As the Black Kos managing editor, I have decided to support this boycott.  I felt it was important and necessary to state why we are doing so, in my own words. During the past several months the atmosphere at Daily Kos has become poisoned to the point where there is no longer any meaningful discourse occurring.  What was needed was for cooler heads to prevail, and for a more civil tone to be established. Instead, the poisonous atmosphere was allowed to fester and grow until I saw a number of tough sanctions handed out. In my opinion the distribution of these sanctions were neither fair nor even handed. It had a disproportionate effect on members of this community.  This unfair distribution is what lead to the calls for the boycott that we support. Justice requires fairness and equity. My criticism of Markos’ decision is based on his tardiness in stepping up and dealing with this situation, until he was forced to use a crude instrument, rather than any personal animosity, ill will, or accusations against him. Waiting as long as he did allowed the rhetoric to get overheated.  But when finally responding in anger, Markos labeled many of these people with personal epithets that are close to slander. Daily Kos is his blog in more ways than one.

Black Kos has always strived to be an area for civil discourse on issues that not only directly affect race, but also on its intersections. The intersections of race and gender, of race and sexuality, and yes- race and politics.  We have also strived to be Black Kos and not Obama Kos. For example, during the long drawn out Democratic primary we didn’t endorse then Senator Obama until nearly the end, and welcomed Hillary supporters, but we also recognized the historic nature of his run. But history and the Democratic Party also carries a number of heavy ugly stains. Race has divided this party and it’s allies. Race has in the past divided labor movements. Race has divided elections. Race has divided each feminist wave. And yes folks race has divided this blog.

We hope that in our absence people will take time to do some self examination and ask “why are we all here?” I’m here to build a movement. But any movement large enough to be capable of making changes in a country as large and diverse as ours requires being in a coalition that makes you uncomfortable. But your willingness to be able to learn to navigate in a group large enough to make you uncomfortable, is directly related to your commitment to that coalition.

State your case and opinions with passion, express your frustrations with vigor, but always do so with respect.  The internet is a medium for communication, but the greatest fallacy in any communication is that communication has in fact occurred. We hope that our in our absence folks ponder that fact.

David aka dopper0189, Black Kos Managing Editor

Why I support the BKos/Sistahspeak Boycott UPDATED

There are various reasons why the issue of racism and race has trumped my other philosophical beliefs throughout my life. In my 20s I thought myself a Marxist, in my 30s a socialist, in my 40s a social democrat, and now… don’t ask… I feel the last 30 years of Reagan Thatcherism has made most people debt slaves.

But for all that, racism is what led to my political awakening. It happened to myself as a child (I was called Jewboy Jukes) and then, when my adopted kid brother joined the family in 1970 and we moved to the countryside, I got in endless fights because of the horrific names he was called – names I won’t repeat now. Two aesthetics and histories underpinned my literary and historic awakening in my teens and twenties: Gospel, Jazz, Soul, Reggae and the works of Langston Hughes, Richard Wright (Lorca on New York), combined with a terrible fear and compulsion to understand the holocaust, as my mother (who’s grandfather had fled the Armenian Genocide) was adopted by a man who also looked after Jewish refugees from Nazi Europe.

Actually, on second thoughts, it’s no surprise the issue of racism trumps all others in my mind. I see the catastrophic genocidal history of Europe, from the Armenian Genocide to the Bosnian War, as vitiated by racism and nationalism even more than the Marxist categories of class. I could go on more here… But it’s late in Poland and my personal history is not the point.

I’ve been a member of DKos since the elections of 2004. I’ve liked my time here, but the vitriol is sometimes hard to stomach, and I’ve always been wary. I know I’m now known, apart from my diaries about Murdoch, Libya or Islamophobia, as something of a flame wars meta fighter. I’m sorry if I got too involved in that, at my expense or anyone elses. But this only happened at the beginning of the year.

Prior to that, I’ve really doubted people’s expressions of the racism they found on Dkos. I thought this might just be warring egos, or a way of neutralising attacks on the President (I have criticisms especially on economics but I rate his foreign policy). It was only when I got down in the weeds, saw the racial games played by Rainbowgirl (aka Linfar), the horrible racially violent undertones in posts by the like of Arthur Poet, and then the sustained trolling of BKos and its editors, especially Denise Oliver Velez, who I knew from MYDD days, that I got a small clue what it was like to be a black commenter here.

Not only were you patronised, told to stop whining, trolled and had your career demeaned or your background insulted: time and time again, bringing up any issue of racism provoked the classic guilty response: Are you calling me a racist? You’re a reverse ra
cist…. You’re just trying to silence me by talking about race.

Now I know most the people who made the latter comments aren’t racist. Indeed, I think racist comments can be made, exposed, atoned for and learned from, in a way dyed in the wool racists could never expose themselves too. I trust most Kossacks are not any more racist than they are homophobic or sexist. But…

The things I’ve heard said to AAs on this site: for some reason, some intranecine fight that seems to be between right and left, and the presence of the first ever Black President, this age old epithets of ‘Uncle Tom’, and even more group bullying and baiting, has been tolerated against Black Kossacks more than any other group.

I really regret MB’s departure. I was in the thread when an argument erupted between him and various other Kossacks because he seemed to be calling racism a ‘factional issue’. It’s not a factional issue. You can’t take two sides on racism on a progressive site, and the issue is too huge in a national which still remembers segregation, to put racism aside this way. Rereading the thread I realised MB was talking about divulging personal information as a ‘factional issue’ and stepped in to try to explain.

Time and time again that argument has been used against me and Black Kossacks: that they were calling MB racist, or at least enabling it. They were right about the bigger issue: race isn’t a factional thing. But I’m really sorry MB felt he was attacked.

However, the greater issue is racism. Now that, with MB gone, the current round of moderation has literally decimated BKos, removed privileges from most its senior members, and had two important black diarists (and they were important even if you loathed what they said) banned from this site, I can’t carry on here without protest

The stark fact is this:

Black folks at DKos, 3% of the site users, about 30% of the banned and rating pulled users.

So I’m joining the boycott suggested by Robinswing – I’m calling it the Bkos/Sistahspeak Boycott but will happily edit the title when it’s given a proper name. I hope the unbalanced bannings and egregiously race orientated punishments are rectified soon, and that I can continue to update you on the evolving Murdoch story (if not you can find me at the site on my sig). In many ways I love this place, and have made many many friends

I don’t for one moment believe Kos deliberately targeted Black Kossacks, but the net effect is still there. I think he caught out dozens of people who were acting in self defense, but the timing (and lack of knowledge) made them look more like aggressors and bullies. It can happen. No side is free in a factional war from bad behaviour.

But the issue of race is beyond a factional war. It lies at the heart of the problems of my continent, and probably yours. I have to follow my instinct here, and support the cause I hold most dear when I see other Kossacks responding to the call.  

And if I can’t keep off this site because of the issue closest to my heart, then I don’t deserve to be here anyway.

Peace. And I hope I don’t provoke too many flames.

I hope sanity and balance will return here, and I can see you soon

UPDATE ONE: the stats on BKos bannings and privilege removal are not easy to calculate. Srebrel has had a bash

http://www.dailykos.com/…

Others have calculated thirty percent of BKos based on last Fridays Black Kos diary

UPDATE TWO: I mean no disrespect or lack of compassion to other communities who suffer real life harassment both here and in the wider world, but in this particular purge of the last few days, I’ve not seen any other community so targeted as AAs. Forgive me if I’ve got that wrong.

UPDATE THREE: Before I log off for the week, do rec and rate some other amazing ‘boycott diaries’. Some are already on the rec list. Sorry if I don’t have time to link to them all, but check for the boycott tag

Onomastic http://www.dailykos.com/…

Hamden Rice http://www.dailykos.com/…

Hardart http://www.dailykos.com/…

Mr Jaytee http://www.dailykos.com/…

Chicago Minx http://www.dailykos.com/…

Empty Vessel http://www.dailykos.com/…

And many more names signing up in Mets102 original diary

http://www.dailykos.com/…

5:21 PM PT: Also Bubbanomics

http://www.dailykos.com/…

Julie Gulden http://www.dailykos.com/…

ToofolkGr http://www.dailykos.com/…

Actually, I’m proud to be on the same list as these people

6:02 PM PT: I really must go to bed. But more boycott diaries

Unspeakable http://www.dailykos.com/…

Lisa Lockwood http://www.dailykos.com/…

Citizen K http://www.dailykos.com/…

Seeta08 http://www.dailykos.com/…

Raptavio http://www.dailykos.com/…

And an URGENT MESSAGE from SBEREL

http://www.dailykos.com/…

Please do not post new diaries from now, 8:45 PM through 10 PM eastern time.  This is for IGTNT, which is posting at 9 PM.

6:07 PM PT: Also pager http://www.dailykos.com/…

Mapamp http://www.dailykos.com/…

6:20 PM PT: Also Brubs http://www.dailykos.com/…

Kingsmeg http://www.dailykos.com/…

And a heartfelt frontline experience from Mally

http://www.dailykos.com/…

6:26 PM PT: earicle http://www.dailykos.com/…

Really have to go to bed now. 3.30 polish time. I’m sure more diaries will come in overnight. Obviously I can include now I’m logging off for a while. But good luck. I hope our voice is hear. Kos is a progressive, and a reasonable man: I’m sure we’ll find a way through

ORIGINALLY POSTED TO BRIT ON SUN SEP 11, 2011 AT 02:57 PM PDT.

ALSO REPUBLISHED BY THE YES WE CAN PRAGMATISTS AND MOOSE ON THE LOOSE.


Categories: Uncategorized.

/ 414 Comments

414 comments

  2. Kysen

    the one by hardart especially…and it was his first diary ever.

    I don’t have a problem with this being reposted (republished?!) here.

    Really, the only thing I want to ‘keep on top of’ will be ensuring that we don’t allow ourselves to devolve into dKos bashing central.

    I don’t think that would be a constructive path for us or for those boycotters who intend to return to dKos once the week is up.

    I think we ought just do as we always have done…offer a welcoming environment to newcomers and include them in the ongoing conversation here.

    Kos has some housecleanin’ to do…and he is obviously TRYING to do it, I see no reason to throw more mud on his floors during the process.

    If nothing else we can provide a week’s vacation from the vitriol, mockery, instigation, innuendo, insinuation, and overall negativity that the flamewars bring.

    Margaritas for all!

  3. Progressive Witness

    …to see Trashy’s name on a list of recs again!

    Told you I’d show up Brit.  I’m like a bad penny.  😀

    Yeah, so, in my boycott-solidarity diary last night, I had it patiently explained to me that the disparity of impact (and interestingly, unlike others they didn’t just up and deny the disparity itself) was only because “a disproportionate number of Black Kos posters were rule breakers.”  (Parallels or lack thereof to similarly glib arguments about AAs and crime statistics are left as an exercise to the reader).  Oh, and that all that rampant Black Kos rule breaking was only of the purpose of shutting down any criticism of Obama.

    The denial and cognitive dissonance on all this are deafening, but apparently only if you have ears to hear.

    PW

  4. scribe

    But I am pretty sure my boycott is permanent. And I feel sad about that, because I really wanted to be able to stay to support the strong minority voices there that have worked so hard for so long, against awful odds. Espcially Dee, who I admire so very very much.

    But I need to find places where all my relations are genuinely welcome, not just the white ones. I need to be where I am valued equally with the majority, and not considered an “other” or  as a “lesser one” just because of the ways I may differ from the majority group.  As an old, gay, low income woman with a measly two year RN degree, I have very little in common with 97% of the members there who are older, highly educated, affluent white males. I already was invited to leave there once before, (and did) for being one of the uppity womens studies crowd, so I know how it feel first hand. And I’ve seen how much harder it is for those whose skin is not white.

    It’s a mirror of our larger society, in my observations. It’s about the unacknowledged, unconscious blinders of all kinds of privilege: white privilege, class privilege, gender  privilege, heterosexual privilege, the whole array of privileges granted to and enjoyed by straight white males of means, who have always and forever ruled the roost in this country. We’ve come a long way, but it’s still the bare beginning: there is a very very long way to go.

    I find encouragement in the growing number of liberal sites online that are truly open and welcoming to all, and for the sake of my own mental health, I need to spend more of time in these more colorfu, more welcoming places  

  5. HappyinVT

    GOS.

    Firstly, it is too little to late for some number of us.  While the vicious nature of some of the attacks/criticisms of the Administration turned me off it was the attacks from both sides of the Obama divide that did me in a couple of years ago.  Coupled with the obvious bias toward the more supportive crowd by the moderator who had a thankless job either way the site has been sinking for awhile.

    Secondly, I was a bit surprised at the admittedly capricious nature of the punishments.  It would seem that the tendency should have been toward giving the benefit of the doubt instead of “Zap!”  But, not my site, not my rules, not my problem.

    Thirdly, and most importantly, I hope we don’t lose sight of the bigger battle.  Anyone notice that the President is sending his jobs bill to Congress today?  We need to focus on getting the best bill passed quickly.  Oh yeah, and we have an election next year.  Let’s not lose the trees for the forest to screw up an otherwise perfectly good metaphor.  🙂

  7. sberel

    three things

    first you were AWESOME. Thank you so much for doing the kickoff diary and the names.

    second – I do not think there is anyway that Blue Tex wrote a boycott diary, and I suggest removing the links from your diary here for now, until the boycott is over, so that people don’t click.

    third – I ran the numbers myself and it’s 30% (actually 33%) BK people that is Black folks and ALLIES.  So the number is not being described correctly.  

    Great job again, you are awesome.

  8. Mets102

    Your diary was great, and so were many of the others.  I think the show of unity that so many of us engaged in is extremely important.  It was important to let the African America posters know that we have their backs and we are disturbed by what’s happening over there, both in terms of the purge, and in terms of how that site is becoming whiter and whiter by the day.  A site that bills itself as one of the premier Democratic blogs shouldn’t be 90-something percent white.

  11. Adept2u

    Was it to deny clicks?  Not going to work.

    Was it to raise awareness of a problem that exists not only on the Daily Kos but throughout a “progressive” blogosphere that is currently being touted as the netroots base?

    I believe it was the latter rather than the former, although I’m not actually taking part in the boycott.

    So, although I’m not part of the boycott in that I’m banned than a mofo, have absolutely no intention of ever darkening that places door again.  HA HA get it darkening!  I have written letters and sent e-mail to everyone I can think of.

    Left like the Rev. Al Sharpton

    and RIGHT!

    http://adept2u.blogspot.com/20…

    There is no such thing as bad publicity to a movement.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v…

  12. Noor B

    but a comment in Robinswing’s diary.  I won’t link to it, simply because it would take forever to get it without logging back in, and I don’t want to do the latter this week.  I’ve got a bajillion things I need to be doing offline right now, and I need to get cracking.

    At any rate, I was not a member of Black Kos or Criminal Injustice Kos.  That said, I do not like the sort of discipline that goes overboard trying to be even-handed and only ends up being unjust.  There has been plenty of bigotry shown to all sorts of subaltern/so-called minority groups — rserven is a classic example of someone who seems to draw some very nasty commentary, when her contributions are so sorely needed.  I always worry about WYFP getting spillover from the flame wars, too.  We’ve been lucky, but for how long will that hold?

    To me, balance is the key to good moderation.  Temper justice with mercy and compassion, and usually that balance point will be struck.  

    This place is obviously a well-kept secret, I only learned about it today.  I’ve been wishing for a good alternative place that could become a new prog online home.  Apart from running WYFP, I might not go back.  Much depends on what I see going on at the end of the boycott.

  13. bubbanomics

    Glad to see familiar monikers around here.  Would love to read a comment from trashablanca.  Midday here in LA, taking a quick break to say hello.

    Now, the REAL test of fitting in…

    SWEET!  There’s hope for me here.

  14. rexymeteorite

    I doubt very much that markos is personally racist, but the net effect of his moderation effort is still the same: a disproportionate amount of black posters lost their ratings privs or got banned for simply defending themselves against hounding attacks from the same set of dailykos posters.

    I have seen it happen entirely too many times, and thats why I walked out. I know, its not much. How hard is it not to go to a website? But perhaps, with that many people supporting Robinswing’s boycott (and, I mean, it really caught fire. It was amazing.) the message will be heard. We aren’t tolerating racism any more.

  15. rexymeteorite

    I doubt very much that markos is personally racist, but the net effect of his moderation effort is still the same: a disproportionate amount of black posters lost their ratings privs or got banned for simply defending themselves against hounding attacks from the same set of dailykos posters.

    I have seen it happen entirely too many times, and thats why I walked out. I know, its not much. How hard is it not to go to a website? But perhaps, with that many people supporting Robinswing’s boycott (and, I mean, it really caught fire. It was amazing.) the message will be heard. We aren’t tolerating racism any more.

  17. Adept2u

    The editors message was obviously heard and at least acknowledged.

    For those of the unbanned considering not returning, do know that I was thrown out.  Yeah I’m not going back, but had I not been banned and my name slandered for an entire week, and been just someone with their ratings removed and etc. I would have joined the boycott, but I for dang sure would have gone back had the conditions improved.

    I had what I assume is a young person sort of berate me in my post over at the People’s View.  He said something to the effect that when Denise was promoted you came into WEESEEYOU (black site) and told all the Black folks to go back to the Daily Kos, and look at you you just got an internet lynching, aren’t you sorry.

    I’ll say here what I said there, no I’m not sorry.  The internet needs Black voices that will stand up and advance their perspective without cowing or shame. It needs to know that we have our own ideas, our own priorities and we will make them known.  

    I know that’s what I tried to do there, and for those of you who know the story of Uncle Marcus, the idea is not to quit until figuratively killed.  

  18. sricki

    if I failed any of you in this thread… sorry, was not my intention. Went through and fierce’d near every comment — refreshed and soapblox had freaked out at me and erased a lot of ratings and turned others into fails. Tried to fix it, but it keeps reversing everything I do.

    Um so, yah, sorry ’bout that. Lol.

  20. evergreen2

    It’s way past my bedtime in Burque, but wanted to say HI!

    I had been in virtual Libya while most of this was going on, posting to Witnessing Revolution, then surfaced yesterday evening, spent most of the past 24 hours reading stuff.  Supported the boycott but had to keep looking around.

    Tonite Tuesdays Chile, the porch overtaken by all kinds of folks giving their prescriptions as to how Bkos should operate. Ick poo.

    My last comment:

    * [new] Isn’t that what everybody is crowing about? (0+ / 0-)

    That the site has been cleaned up, and those angry poc’s that just can’t seem to keep their anger in check have been cleared out and now we can all talk about racism (as defined by the majority here, which is white) under our (white) terms and contentedly without yelling.

    That’s exactly what I meant by my comment.  In all seriousness.

    So welcome to the new all cleaned up Bkos Porch!!

    by evergreen2 on Tue Sep 13, 2011 at 10:36:03 PM MDT

    The whole first part of a great diary was trashed, so Oke was sitting on the swing saying she was gonna stay onsite, keeping a list and naming names, for which, of course she was dumped on.  It felt like the porch was being violated, you know what I mean?

    All I’ve read, the gyst is we the community (read majority) should determine what is and isn’t racism, and how it should be discussed, and that will lead to a better more inclusive and civil discourse.

    Someone tell me how to post a link here and I’ll give you the coolest music ala the LIbyan revolution, LIbyana Hits 100.1 FM out of Benghazi.

    Namaste!

  21. Kay W

    Just checking in briefly to say hello and wish everyone well.  

    I’m now known as Kay W – for Kay Whitlock,my IRL name.  

  22. Kay W

    simply as Criminal Injustice – will post tonight (and every Wednesday) at 6 P.M. Central Time at

    Critical Mass Progress

    Visit the site now if you’ve got a minute and check on “About” to learn more about the site’s values and principles – and about Seeta Persaud, its founder.

    Soothsayer is the series Editor, and I am now, along with princss6 and others, a Contributing Editor and a helper elf for sooth!  

  23. Jjc2008

    I missed a lot of the details of what happened at Dkos.  I did figure it out…somewhat.

    I recognize some names from Dkos and MyDD.  I had some battles back in the primary wars.  

    I sort of boycotted Dkos on my own for a while.  Frankly I saw a lot of sexism back then.   But we all see things in our own way, based on our own experience.  

    I do not think I could ever understand what racism feels like, since I am not a person of color.  I do remember what ethnic slurs could feel like….having grown up in a first generation of immigrants from the poorest parts of Italy.  While often humor was used, I failed, even as a young kid, to get the humor of false generalizations of an ethnic group most likely being violent, murderous thieves (as in mafia).  No one in our family back then, pre The Godfather, saw anything remotely romantic about criminals.

    Anyway, whether or Dkos or MyDD or even here, I have learned that for me, sometimes I need to back off.  I KNOW I sometimes take things too personally and it interferes with my ability to rationally discuss things.  I am getting better at backing off and taking breaks.

    My “point of view” with some things is not always in sync with some nuprogressives (by that I mean younger than me).  

    I am a retired teacher and clearly my views of education are skewed to a point of view that is not universal.  I found myself getting even angrier than usual this year as more and more the right demonized public education and teachers in general.  And when I saw some support of that point of view on progressive blogs, it was difficult.  My point is this: I can see how some members of the progressive community who happen to be black might feel frustrated with some on dkos.  With an African American president, with so much power in the right wing media, I suspect the frustration runs over. I can see, as a H. Clinton supporter, that a similar situation over gender may have arisen had she won the office.  

    We are in tough times, our president trying to figure out how to deal with a right wing extremist party who would rather see the country fail than to allow a democratic president win.  I don’t always agree with how he deals with the right, but I do not believe that reflects on anything other than how Barack Obama, the person deals with things in general.  

    Anyway, I know now that on any blog, whether liberal or progressive there will be intense discussions……because as a rule, by nature of how we define ourselves, liberals/progressives do not go in lock step for any one.  It is what it is.

    Just my 2 cents.

  24. mrsbrown

    I’m so glad to have found this site.

    I joined DKOS last January, but discovered quickly that the site was not for me.

    Too much negativity and too anti-Obama.

    Plus, all the fighting in the comments really turned me off.

    I never commented because the people on that site scared me.

    The lack of civility and personal attacks were intimidating.

    I did lurk there, though, so feel as though I know some of the members.

    I did read about the boycott and agree with the boycotters and fortunately, through the boycott I discovered this site and find that it suits me.

    My days at the DKOS are over and I hope to be calling The Motley Moose home from now on.

  25. CA ridebalanced

    Thanks to the Motley Crew for being so welcoming

    to those of us who are on strike against the GOS.

    I was never much of a commenter there, and never

    posted a diary. Yet I read daily, and felt I got

    to know quite a few of the people by their writing.

    I must admit that I prefer the civility here to

    the cacophony of the other site. It’s great to see

    Brit/Peter, Adept (I’m one of the UFO-ers…and

    yes, I found your blogspot also), BJM, and the

    others whose names I recognize.

    After reading your BKos update Peter, I felt that

    it was time to register here as I think I’ve

    found a new blog home. I became quite addicted

    to the new knowledge that Bkos was teaching me.

    I’m a history buff with a serious hole in the

    Black History department. So, it was great to have

    SOMETHING that spurred me into researching things

    and peoples I knew little or nothing about. It was

    also the place I got to witness some Great White

    Privilege denialism, as well as blatant racism.

    This middle aged lily white azzed woman won’t,

    absolutely WILL NOT, tolerate racism in my real

    life. I did not quite know what to say to online

    shit stirrers. Mostly I said nothing, quite to

    my shame. I have a healthy distrust in online

    relationships for the most part anyway, and the

    Kos experience just reinforced my skepticism.

    So, to the BKos members who are reading, I have to

    apologize to you. I never voiced my concerns

    about the treatment that you were

    on the receiving end of. I am sorry. I did not stand

    tall with you until Robinswing called for the

    boycott. All that I can do now is to say something

    in the future when I see it online.  

    Hello Motley Moose. I might actually comment here

    more than I did over there. If that’s okay with

    you……what do you call yourselves anyways. I

    do hope it’s not Mooseketeers?  🙂

     

  26. Sarea

    And glad to see that this site will not devolve into constant meta and DKos bashing.

    Which is why I’ll state my experience here in this post and hopefully will not feel compelled to talk about it too much.

    I can’t remember which I discovered/lurked/joined first:  Daily Kos or Street Prophets. But for years I mostly lurked on GOS and was a regular poster on SP.  At one point Street Prophets was perfect for me, as I was going through a major struggle with deciding whether or not to leave my church.  (Was raised in a conservative Christian church / small town, so leaving for me was a “BIG DEAL.”)

    For the most part the members of Street Prophets welcomed me with open arms, I made friends both on the site and IRL, and I learned SO much.  Sometimes it felt like taking a master class in comparative or world religions.  It was awesome.

    But there was a certain…treatment, I guess, of some of the queer members on the site that made me uncomfortable.  Almost a dissmissiveness, and a lack of respect/understanding –  especially when they tried to communicate their feelings about this treatment. Eventually it led to pie fights etc etc that hastened my departure from the site.  Many of my favorite folks were no longer there and I no longer felt a part of the community.

    Which is why this whole situation at DKos felt eerily familiar.  As I mentioned somewhere else, it’s not cool for the marginalized in society to feel marginalized in a progressive / liberal community.  It’s just not.

    And I saw that same kind of behavior (and acceptance of the behavior) towards AAs, women and the queer community on DKos, for a long time.  It made me uncomfortable.  

    I like it here. 🙂  It reminds me of something I really liked about Street Prophets: in general, a higher level of respectful treatment of other users, and a slower pace where I can actually read and keep up with the conversation.

    So thanks for the welcomes!

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